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Thread: 2012 Rule Change Suggestions

  1. #1
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    2012 Rule Change Suggestions

    Suggestions for the 2012 rulebook are now open and will be accepted until Monday October 3rd, 2011. Once the list is compiled, the proposed rule changes will be mailed to all members. Rule changes can be submitted to the VP of Rules and Tech, or to any rider representative. The preferred method would be for racers to submit rule changes via this thread.

    In this thread, I would like your input on when would be the best time to hold a rule change meeting (Saturday-Sunday-afternoon-evening-etc…..) Once a meeting time has been determined, it will be specified in this and an additional thread.

    The meeting is open to all members and will be held to discuss the proposed rule 2012 changes. The members attending this meeting will be encouraged to give input on which changes should be presented to the MRA board for approval. We would like to have finalized rule changes for the 2012 season in place before the end of the year.

    When making your suggestion, be sure to cite the existing rule and what changes you are suggesting. If it is a new rule, please use the exact wording as you would like it to appear at the rule change meeting and possibly the rulebook.

    If you want to discuss your rule change proposal, please start a separate thread.

    If you have any questions please shoot me a PM.

  2. #2
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    Ok I'll start off:

    Current Rule-

    4.2 Amateur definition
    A. Amateur is used to define combined race classes only and is not a license status.
    Novice and Expert racers may race together in classes specified as Amateur.
    B. Experts who race Amateur GTO, Amateur GTU or Formula 40 are ineligible for
    RoR GTO and RoR GTU races during the same weekend. A racer entering either
    Amateur GTO, Amateur GTU or Formula 40 and either RoR GTO or RoR GTU
    will be removed from the results and will lose all contingency and earnings from
    both Amateur, Formula 40 and RoR classes for that weekend.
    C. Any racer who begins the season as an expert class racer and finishes in the
    top 5 overall at the end of the year in Amateur GTO or Amateur GTU will be
    ineligible for both Amateur GTO and Amateur GTU in subsequent seasons.
    Novice racers that finish in the top 5 of Amateur GTO or Amateur GTU are
    exempt from this rule, as are racers that begin the season as a novice but advance
    to expert during that season.

    Proposed Change:

    4.2 Amateur definition
    A. Amateur is used to define combined race classes only and is not a license status.
    Novice and Expert racers may race together in classes specified as Amateur.
    B. Experts who race Amateur GTO or Amateur GTU are ineligible for
    RoR GTO and RoR GTU races during the same weekend. A racer entering either
    Amateur GTO or Amateur GTU and either RoR GTO or RoR GTU
    will be removed from the results and will lose all contingency and earnings from
    both Amateur and RoR classes for that weekend.
    C. Any racer who begins the season as an expert class racer and finishes in the
    top 5 overall at the end of the year in Amateur GTO or Amateur GTU will be
    ineligible for both Amateur GTO and Amateur GTU in subsequent seasons.
    Novice racers that finish in the top 5 of Amateur GTO or Amateur GTU are
    exempt from this rule, as are racers that begin the season as a novice but advance
    to expert during that season.
    D. Experts who race RoR and are top 5 in the standings in RoR GTO or RoR GTU are ineligible for Formula 40 race that same weekend. A racer entering Formula 40 and RoR and is top 5 in RoR GTO or RoR GTU will be removed from the results and will lose all contingency and earnings from both Formula 40 and RoR classes for that weekend. First race weekend of the season's eligibility will be based on previous season standings.

    Reasoning:
    The current rule was proposed at the introduction of the new Formula 40 to provide a class for over 40 riders that are not necessarily at the level of competition of our over 40 fast riders like Turpin, Orlando, Turner, etc. The negative effect of this has been riders that normally run RoR but are not running with the leaders have forsaken RoR to run Formula 40. This past weekend, 7 of the top 8 finishers in Formula 40 were previous RoR competitors. The RoR grid has shrunk while the Formula 40 grid has increased. By passing this rule change, it will have little or no effect on who is currently running Formula 40, but will allow those riders to run RoR again if they are not in the top 10 in the overall championship points.
    MRA #29

  3. #3
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    I like it, a good suggestion to get more riders on both grids.
    #145 Wyeth Jackson
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  4. #4
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    and another-

    Current Rule-

    4.6 Novice to Expert advancement process
    E. For the purposes of this section ‘community service’ may include but not be confined to scorekeeping, approved event participation, attending 4 general meetings or any other service as defined and approved by the Board. This now also includes the option to “purchase” your service hours for a payment of $100 to the MRA. You can either pay the amount in full, or work the full 4 hours.

    Proposed Change-
    E. For the purposes of this section ‘community service’ may include but not be confined to cornerworking, scorekeeping, approved event participation, attending general meetings or any other service as defined and approved by the Board. General meeting attendance will equate to 1/2 hour of community service for each meeting attended, and all 4 community service hours cannot be earned by only attending general meetings. This now also includes the option to “purchase” your service hours for a payment of $100 to the MRA. You can either pay the amount in full, or work the full 4 hours.

    Reasoning:
    In the past 2 seasons the MRA has made a concentrated effort to market the club to potential new riders and spectators by having exhibits at events that we deem benefical to increasing our exposure, resulting in the club remaining viable and solvent. Unfortunately the number of volunteers for these events has been disappointing. These have usually been staffed by board members or a small percentage of the club's novice and expert racers. In many instances, the same novices will volunteer for events even after they have met their community service requirement. By limiting the number of community hours that a novice can earn by simply attending the club's general meetings, the expectancy is that there will be more volunteers for other events.
    MRA #29

  5. #5
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    Current Rule-

    2.10 Production 250 Cup Class


    H. Suspension may be modified with different springs, valves and oil. The stock unaltered rear shock body and stock fork tubes must be retained. Preload adjusters may be added to the forks. Rear ride height may be altered or adjusted, including use of aftermarket dog-bones.

    Proposed Rule-

    H. Suspension may be modified with different springs, valves and oil. The stock unaltered rear shock body and stock fork tubes must be retained. Preload adjusters and valve emulators may be added to the forks. Stock damping rod must be retained but can be modified. Rear ride height may be altered or adjusted, including use of aftermarket dog-bones.
    MRA #29

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by UglyDogRacing

    Proposed Rule-

    H. Suspension may be modified with different springs, valves and oil. The stock unaltered rear shock body and stock fork tubes, including damping rod, must be retained. Preload adjusters and valve emulators may be added to the forks. Rear ride height may be altered or adjusted, including use of aftermarket dog-bones.
    Jim, do you mean to propose that ONLY springs, valves and oil can be changed in the fork tubes, or that valve emulators can be added? You listed the damping rod in the same sentence as everything else you wish to remain unaltered. The first job in installing emulators is to alter the damping rod with a drill to render it useless or it is pointless to take the forks apart.

  7. #7
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    Chris meant to say that the damping rod must be retained. Modified the post
    MRA #29

  8. #8
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    Hey Shannon, I propose a Sunday afternoon for the rules committee meeting. That way the shops are closed. 8)
    #145 Wyeth Jackson
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  9. #9
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    Current:

    3.1F Racers holding a current professional roadrace license from another organization cannot compete in amateur only classes.


    Proposed:

    F. Racers holding a current professional roadrace license from another organization cannot compete in amateur only classes, with the exception of an AMA Supersport License.


    Rationale: AMA Supersport rules in recent years have changed that from factory level racing to a support class. The level of rider in the AMA Supersport class is in line with what the MRA typically sees from a first year expert, and is consistent with Amateur Status in the MRA. Those riders competing in AMA Daytona Sportbike and Superbike should not be permitted to run Amateur classes.
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  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by rybo
    Current:

    3.1F Racers holding a current professional roadrace license from another organization cannot compete in amateur only classes.


    Proposed:

    F. Racers holding a current professional roadrace license from another organization cannot compete in amateur only classes, with the exception of an AMA Supersport License.


    Rationale: AMA Supersport rules in recent years have changed that from factory level racing to a support class. The level of rider in the AMA Supersport class is in line with what the MRA typically sees from a first year expert, and is consistent with Amateur Status in the MRA. Those riders competing in AMA Daytona Sportbike and Superbike should not be permitted to run Amateur classes.
    I'd ask us to clarify what "amateur only classes" is, does this mean the Amateur GTU and Amateur GTO classes? Or our "amateur status" classes, AmU, AmO, Thunderbike, Prod 250, F40, Endurance, etc?

    I'd propose that it mean the Amateur GTU and Amateur GTO classes only.
    #145 Wyeth Jackson
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  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by oldtimer
    Quote Originally Posted by rybo
    Current:

    3.1F Racers holding a current professional roadrace license from another organization cannot compete in amateur only classes.


    Proposed:

    F. Racers holding a current professional roadrace license from another organization cannot compete in amateur only classes, with the exception of an AMA Supersport License.


    Rationale: AMA Supersport rules in recent years have changed that from factory level racing to a support class. The level of rider in the AMA Supersport class is in line with what the MRA typically sees from a first year expert, and is consistent with Amateur Status in the MRA. Those riders competing in AMA Daytona Sportbike and Superbike should not be permitted to run Amateur classes.
    I'd ask us to clarify, does this mean the Amateur GTU and Amateur GTO classes? Or our "amateur status" classes, AmU, AmO, Thunderbike, Prod 250, F40, Endurance, etc?

    I'd propose that it mean the Amateur GTU and Amateur GTO classes only.
    So, now I'll ask for a clarification of your clarification -

    do you mean that riders with an AMA pro license CAN or CANNOT race in Thunderbike, Prod 250, F40 and Endurance?
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  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by rybo

    So, now I'll ask for a clarification of your clarification -

    do you mean that riders with an AMA pro license CAN or CANNOT race in Thunderbike, Prod 250, F40 and Endurance?

    Yes our racers CAN race in the other classes with an AMA Pro license. We have a long history of it in Endurance already.
    #145 Wyeth Jackson
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  13. #13
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    How about this instead?

    Quote Originally Posted by rybo
    Current:

    3.1F Racers holding a current professional roadrace license from another organization cannot compete in amateur only classes.


    Proposed:

    F. Racers holding a current professional roadrace license from another organization cannot compete in amateur GTU and GTO classes, with the exception of those possessing an AMA Supersport License.


    Rationale: AMA Supersport rules in recent years have changed that from factory level racing to a support class. The level of rider in the AMA Supersport class is in line with what the MRA typically sees from a first year expert, and is consistent with Amateur Status in the MRA. Those riders competing in AMA Daytona Sportbike and Superbike should not be permitted to run Amateur classes.
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  14. #14
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    Given the current problem of low attendance and signups, maybe we should make it so that:

    NOVICE classes are "protected classes" meaning that ONLY Novices can run them.

    All others are considered ADVANCED (instead of Expert or Amateur) classes, and novices and Experts CAN run those classes (we let the Novices in half of the races anyway...)

    Not withstanding the current "fast guys can't run true amateur classes"

    muddy?
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    Tony -

    The manufacturers that still pay contingency won't do so if we allow novice racers into the Supersport and Superbike classes - they have to be expert only classes for Yamaha and Suzuki to play.

    Last year they specifically said it, this year they were less firm on it, perhaps next year they will drop the requirement all together?

    S
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  16. #16
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    OK How about this:

    Novice Only Classes

    -Novice GTU / GTO

    Expert Only Classes

    - MW / HW / Open SuperSport
    - MW / HW / Open Superbike
    - ROR


    Mixed Classes:

    All others


    AMA Pro Daytona Sportbike and American Superbike License Holders may only compete in Expert Only Classes

    AMA Pro Supersport License Holders may compete in any non-novice class unless excluded by some other rule (amateur advancement rule comes to mind)

    Pro level licenses from other roadracing organizations will be evaluated by MRA staff to determine rider / class eligibility.
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  17. #17
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    I like it.
    #145 Wyeth Jackson
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  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by rybo
    OK How about this:

    Novice Only Classes

    -Novice GTU / GTO

    Expert Only Classes

    - MW / HW / Open SuperSport
    - MW / HW / Open Superbike
    - ROR


    Mixed Classes:

    All others


    AMA Pro Daytona Sportbike and American Superbike License Holders may only compete in Expert Only Classes

    AMA Pro Supersport License Holders may compete in any non-novice class unless excluded by some other rule (amateur advancement rule comes to mind)

    Pro level licenses from other roadracing organizations will be evaluated by MRA staff to determine rider / class eligibility.
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  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by rybo

    Expert Only Classes

    - MW / HW / Open SuperSport
    - MW / HW / Open Superbike
    - ROR


    Mixed Classes:

    All others


    AMA Pro Daytona Sportbike and American Superbike License Holders may only compete in Expert Only Classes
    Oops I just realized this won't work.

    Endurance is still a factor, I don't want to ban our guys from Endurance if they go to run Daytona Sportbike or Superbike. Dimick, Ricky, Galster have run Daytona Sportbike this year. SuperTwins also comes to mind--KTM $--Chris Fillmore Daytona Sportbike racer.

    Let's tinker with this idea more. I don't want to limit our fast guys to ONLY MW-HW-O + RoR if they have a chance to run nationals. Everyone in our club should be able to run Endurance if they want to, and frankly I think they should be able to run the other classes too. If a guy has a 250 in the Cup races and a 1000 in RoR he shouldn't be penalized for pulling a national license.

    Maybe we focus on AmU and AmO as stepping stone classes after novice? No Pro licensed racers in those.
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  20. #20
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    yup =

    give me a little bit - I'll take another stab at it
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  21. #21
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    Add 2004 and up Aprilia RSV and all years of the Aprilia Tuono to list of eligible bikes for Thunderbike

    Rationale: The RSV is not an overdog compared to a superbike 749R / 848. At stock displacement there is no greater advantage with this bike than any of the other bikes on the list.

    (FWIW - this isn't a personally motivated rule change suggestion - the RSV I'm getting is a superbike and doesn't meet the "stock displacement" clause)



    Current Rule:
    2.8 Thunderbike
    This is an Amateur class allowing superbike modifications to the specifications listed below:
    • Up to 850cc two cylinder, liquid cooled, four stroke
    • Up to 350cc two cylinder, liquid cooled, two stroke
    • Up to 700cc three cylinder, four stroke
    • Unlimited displacement two cylinder, air cooled, two valve
    • Unlimited displacement single cylinder

    Additionally, the following bikes are permitted to compete but must remain OEM displacement and are the only bikes allowed to be over the displacement limits: Aprilia Mille – PRE 2004 models / Ducati – 916 and 996 / Honda – RC-51, Superhawk VTR 100 / Triumph – Daytona 955 and Speed Triple 955 / Suzuki – SV1000, TLS and TLR. Homologation specials exceeding the class displacement limits are excluded. This includes but not limited to Ducati models with SPS, R, and RS designations if they displace greater then 850cc.

    Proposed Rule

    2.8 Thunderbike
    This is an Amateur class allowing superbike modifications to the specifications listed below:
    • Up to 850cc two cylinder, liquid cooled, four stroke
    • Up to 350cc two cylinder, liquid cooled, two stroke
    • Up to 700cc three cylinder, four stroke
    • Unlimited displacement two cylinder, air cooled, two valve
    • Unlimited displacement single cylinder

    Additionally, the following bikes are permitted to compete but must remain OEM displacement and are the only bikes allowed to be over the displacement limits: Aprilia Mille, Aprilia Tuono / Ducati – 916 and 996 / Honda – RC-51, Superhawk VTR 100 / Triumph – Daytona 955 and Speed Triple 955 / Suzuki – SV1000, TLS and TLR. Homologation specials exceeding the class displacement limits are excluded. This includes but not limited to Ducati models with SPS, R, and RS designations if they displace greater then 850cc.
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  22. #22
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    I want to propose we allow slicks in the 250 prod class, my reasoning for this is that my slicks cost less than my dots for the turd fiddys and after talking with Oscar sounds like the same is true for the Dunnys. Cost was one of the driving reasons for this class and if so this makes total sense to me and if tire availability is not a issue then lets open it up and let the riders decide what to run.
    If I remember right we did not want to allow rains in the class so you don't need two sets of wheels but we can still disallow rains.

  23. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bartman
    I want to propose we allow slicks in the 250 prod class, my reasoning for this is that my slicks cost less than my dots for the turd fiddys and after talking with Oscar sounds like the same is true for the Dunnys. Cost was one of the driving reasons for this class and if so this makes total sense to me and if tire availability is not a issue then lets open it up and let the riders decide what to run.
    If I remember right we did not want to allow rains in the class so you don't need two sets of wheels but we can still disallow rains.
    Current Rule
    2.10 Production 250 Cup Class
    M. Tires must be DOT rated tires only.

    Proposed Rule
    2.10 Production 250 Cup Class
    M. Tires may be DOT rated or slicks.
    MRA #29

  24. #24
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    Per Tony Baker:

    Original:
    2.10
    K. Hand and foot controls, rearsets, handlebars, and levers may be replaced with parts of unlimited origin. Brake master cylinders and throttle control must remain stock

    Change:
    2.10
    K. Hand and foot controls, rearsets, handlebars, brake master cylinders, and levers may be replaced with parts of unlimited origin. Throttle control must remain stock

  25. #25
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    Under 2.2.2 B
    I would like to add
    f radiator.
    The reason I want this is bikes are getting faster but are also getting hotter and this is a big problem at altitude and does constitute a safety hazard so I would like to give the members the option to add larger radiators or modify stock ones to compensate for the extra temps that altitude causes.

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