Rule change for numbers... What do you think?

[PersianThunder]

Im looking at 5.3 sec D
"Numbers must be approximatly 8" tall and 1" wide, of standard black lettering with no shading or outlining."

We were hoping to take out the "standard block lettering with no shading or outlining." Leave in there its up to the tech inspector to approve legibility but wanting to have some fun like moto GP and moto2 with outlines or gradients in numbers.

Want to make clear though im not pushing for tiny numbers you cant read, i still feel if the score keepers/tech inspector cant read them it wont work. But there are already examples like Aaron Petries number or Hammers number that are still legible but red instead of black and have an outline.

[rybo]

I'm sorry, but the rule change suggestion period for 2010 is over.

We'll be discussing the rule changes at the walnut room on Sunday, the 17th starting at 1:00 PM

See you there!

[PersianThunder]

I heard that i just wanted to see if people agreed or objected. Ill be showing up on sunday but wanted to see reactions/opinions test the waters so to speak.

[JimWilson29]

After manually scoring you guys for 2 days straight at Pueblo, I would be against any rule change that would make numbers harder to read. We've already become lax on the enforcement of the current rule. I'm not against numbers like what Aaron Petrie has. Even the numbers that Aaron did for me are outlined so technically against the rules. But they are large, centered and easy to read. So I don't think a rule change is necessary. It will be up to Tech to enforce the current rule a little more so that we don't have to struggle as much doing manual scoring.

[PersianThunder]

I agree with you completely i just want to change the "solid black" and "no outline" part of the rule... have no objections to anything else.

I mean if nobody cares and we dont have to change it and we can do it anyway sure but since it seems many are doing it anyway just thought id modify it so it wasnt illegal anymore.

[Scored51]

As someone who manually score kept for several years as well as sold custom die cut numbers at the track for a short period, I have been on both ends of the stick of this one. However, there are soooo many characteristics that make a number legible or not for any given scorekeeper. The numbers themselves can have different font characteristics, the angle of the bodywork, whether they are shiny or matte finish, the speed distance at which they must be scored... (yadda, yadda, yadda!)

The bottom line is the AMA has 2 acceptable fonts, in one size, that EVERYONE has to run wheather you are Matt Mladin or Johnny Rock Page. The text in the MRA rulebook may be outdated as it specifies the size of number plate to be attached to the bike, but this hasn't been the issue: enforcement has.

The last round at PMP gave the board members a first hand look at how difficult it is to scorekeep with the loose and modern number displays we have on most bikes, and the dependability we all have come to enjoy of the transponder system. I expect there will be a review and revamp of how the club chooses to improve these long standing scoring concerns, but I would venture to say this is the domain of the board rather than voter approved. Afterall, if I can't read your number you ain't gonna get scored no matter how cool anyone thinks it looks.

[JimWilson29]

The bottom line is the AMA has 2 acceptable fonts, in one size, that EVERYONE has to run wheather you are Matt Mladin or Johnny Rock Page.

Not anymore-

[PersianThunder]

Just stuff like that! of using different colors for the actual numbers.
Im not trying to make it harder to read just trying to have some fun with design.

[peteyt328]

I think the rule should just be that they are legible from a certain distance. If they are not than its your own fault if something goes wrong with the AMB setup and you are not scored.

As far as the size goes, I don't think that is something you can enforce since every bike is different and it seems the newer bikes are getting smaller and smaller fairings. I know on my 09 zx6r there is no single flat surface big enough for the required size numbers. I believe the late R6's are the same way

[racedk6]

I agree with Pete as long as you can read it from a certain distance it should be allowed.

[dragos13]

Currently, the rulebook is NOT being enforced when it comes to numbers. The numbers on the front of my bike are illegal as they are only 4" tall.

Now, you can run whatever you want (shading, outlines, colors, etc) and "most likely" make it through tech. The issue you will find is when we go to manual scoring and you aren't on results, your protest will be invalid as your numbers are illegal.

[Scored51]

Amendment! Up until recently the AMA used on two fonts...

I think the rule should just be that they are legible from a certain distance. If they are not than its your own fault if something goes wrong with the AMB setup and you are not scored.

That is the nature of the problem with disaster written all over it. It isn't until after the fact (and some investigation) that you get to figure out who's numbers you can't read and what works and doesn't for each scorekeeper. This is why manual scorekeeping requires so many people to perform the task effectively. Also, numbers that are easy to read at PMP could be impossible to see at PPIR and vice versa because every track provides a different set of challenges for scoring. I would doubt the membership would be willing to create a rule with such a vague language knowing the consequence of non compliance is disqualification based on the subjective opinion of an individual who is not even a board member of their club. It reminds me of the arguements about a rider who "causes" a red flag situation being punished based on the account of a corner worker who may or may not have actually witnessed the crash.

When the Board does convene on this issue in the off season, I'm sure the result will be a logical and reasonable guideline (with or without a rule change) that has some lattitude for the application concerns of modern bodywork and consistent objective enforcement. I have to add that scorekeeping is a practiced skill. The efforts the Board put forth at PMP may have had a lot of issues, but it was actually pretty damn good as a first try. You improve by consistently doing it, and the main reason is because you learn tricks that have nothing to do with how a number is displayed.

[DOUBLE A]

I will be bribing the tech insp. so I can have cool numbers : P :lol:

[phildrummond]

Seems like the perfect time to re-visit a request for Roman numerals. If I agree to "block-style font", can I run CDXVI?

[T Baggins]

I say we abolish numbers altogether, and if the AMB system fails again, we score ourselves by the honor system... :shock:

[racedk6]

I say we abolish numbers altogether, and if the AMB system fails again, we score ourselves by the honor system... :shock:

That means Grubbs will win every class! Even LOR!

[JimWilson29]

I say we abolish numbers altogether, and if the AMB system fails again, we score ourselves by the honor system... :shock:

That means Grubbs will win every class! Even LOR!

Grubbs the honor system means everyone else will have to also confirm where you finished, which means you'll probably be last in every race.