effen cheatin suzukis!

[Clarkie]

ya that would work Brad, or even just compared each bike to each other, one day they make make 110 the next 115 but if they are making 110 and one pops up at 120 you know there is something to look at

the other way is to not strap them down at all, i may have to eat more for lunch as the 1000's will hop the rear wheel when not strapped down but that is one variable taken out of the equation

[Clarkie]

Wouldn't that make it more fair? All top 5 bikes strapped the same and on the tire they just came off the track on? I'm sure it'd be a pain in the arse, but it seems the one sure fire way to level the playing field in supersport.
carl

it also changes between bikes depending on the linkage ratio, not all bike make more strapped down, some make more with less tension on them. A lot of bikes will make more with a stock shock than with a race shock if they arent cranked down, if you dont crank them down but start playing with the compression in the shock it will change them hp shown, crazy huh

If you have a bike on the dyno and someone that needs to eat a bit more like Dingle that weight nothing dyno's the bike, and then someone that likes to eat lunch dyno's the bike the hp number will be more, as dyno shops we go through this all the time, trying to explain why someone's bike 'lost' power after their 'hot mod' they found on the internet when in reality the last time they were on the dyno was in March with crisp cool air and 5% humidity compared to August when it is 105 with 60% humidity and they changed the gearing, tires etc etc, quad guys are the worst!

[DingleBerns]

Just out of curiosity....

This is off the topic, but regarding those bikes that were found to be illegal and were fined $50 because there was not a huge performance advantage.

What about running slicks in supersport? Those are illegal as well and could be classified as not being a huge performance advantage. If a racer runs slicks in supersport will there be a $50 fine or will they be DQ'd?

[Hotrod]

I'm gonna beat brownie to it:

... oh, Dingle....
:wink:

[Ray-Ray]

Just out of curiosity....

This is off the topic, but regarding those bikes that were found to be illegal and were fined $50 because there was not a huge performance advantage.

What about running slicks in supersport? Those are illegal as well and could be classified as not being a huge performance advantage. If a racer runs slicks in supersport will there be a $50 fine or will they be DQ'd?

Dingle - Read the rule book. 2.2.2 G Only DOT tires may be used. If someone ran slicks in a SS class then they could be DQ'd and lose their points in that class for the season.

[DingleBerns]

what about the mods that were illegal at hastings, were those in the rule book and stated like the tire issue regarding DQ's?

*Edit*

Section 13.C explained it.

Now my question....

Knowing that running slicks in SS and the mods found in hastings are both illegal for supersport because of these two specific rules

1)

2.2.2 G Only DOT tires may be used. If someone ran slicks in a SS class then they could be DQ'd and lose their points in that class for the season.

and

2)

Section 13

C. Upon entering any motorcycle in any MRA class, the rider is responsible for their motorcycle meeting class requirements. If at any time the entered motorcycle is found to be illegal for the entered class, the rider will forfeit points and monies earned in that class for that day, and all points earned previously that year in that same class.

Why does one result in a $50 dollar fine and the other a DQ when they both are illegal and both are not a huge performance advantage?

I don't even run supersport, I just want clarification.

Thanks! Dingle

[polar x]

As much as I love seeing someone else being in the target zone I am gonna take a peak over the berm 8)

Why are you all baiting the board/Ray? They/he is trying to do their job and be fair without being an ass. Did he and or the board make a mistake? One could argue for both sides ( I would have done it differently) but that's quarterbacking and hindsight. Ray has the clubs best interest at hand as does the rest of the board. The rule book is a contract with the club, and as such it does carry a certain INTENT clause that has to come into the judgment phase. They did what they thought was best for the situation and its over. Clearly the rule book needs to be changed to allow more flexibility or less aggressive penalty's. But that's for 09 and all this poking at them does the club no good. I don't just say this because Ray is a friend, I would say this for Ben, Bart and Glenn if they were in the position. And I have been on the poo flinging side (and I like it) so don't think I don't understand.

And just so my stand/view is clear, I DO agree with Chris. If I were the tech guy I would have DQ'd them all for infractions (regardless of the boards view since it would be my call) and when the poo flew I would have swatted it back at them with a copy of rule book. END OF DISCUSSION. Would not make any friends but it would have been right and defensible. IMHO

[Lurch]

Where is the Track Marshall when all this is going on? Unless the rulebook has been changed since I was involved the Track Marshall is suppose to take care of all protest.

Lurch

[Tumbleweed]

Yes I believe a mistake was made at Hastings. Yes, I did not put the rule # on the protest at Pueblo which made the protest invalid. Yes I believe the way the protest was handled in Pueblo by Glenn Conser to me was wrong. Can any of this be changed now, NO. Therefore I will not bring up the past again after this post. In my opinion there have been many mistakes made by members of the board this season. Hopefully these mistakes will not be made again in the future.

Glenn: As far as the conversation we had at Pueblo, you were wrong by how you handled the situation. The protest was made to give the MRA a chance to right the wrong that was made in Hastings. Whether you believe the decision in hastings was right or wrong doesn't matter. I was giving the opportunity for the decision to be corrected by pointing out yet another thing illegal on Danny Andersons #445 bike. Yes in the past two seasons Danny has bent the rules a few times and always gotten away with it. I have protested him last season and this season for breaking rules and both of my protests have been thrown out due to my mistakes of making my own protest form on computer paper improperly(sidenote: I think protest forms should be provided by the MRA so that we can properly call out rule breakers) and because of rulebook interpretations last season. You can look at that as me having something against Danny if you want. The bottom line is I am just calling him out on his illegal bike. Is Danny a good racer, Absolutely. Is he fast, Absolutely. Have I beaten him this season on a 750 while he was riding his R1, Yes. So to say I am protesting him because I can't beat him is incorrect on your part once again. And why would it matter if he is faster than me or not. Bottom line is he broke rules so stop changing the subject to discredit me. Back to why you are wrong by the way you handled the situation in Pueblo. When you and Ray came to talk with me, Ray explained that I filled out the protest form improperly and the protest was being thrown out. I fully expected something like this so I was ready. I said, you are right, I understand I made a mistake and I understand why it was thrown out due to my mistake. This is where the discussion should have ended but it didn't. At this point you stepped in to the conversation and asked me what I have against Danny. This should have never been asked due to fact that it had nothing to do with the situation. Being me I answered you with an honest answer that he has broken rules before and it pisses me off that the MRA has not found him to be at fault so I will protest him again when I find something wrong with his bike. After this you explained to me in so many words that this is club racing and I shouldn't take these things so seriously. To this I say you are wrong. I have been fighting this battle simply on ethics and principle. I believe people should do their absolute best to follow the rules. In the conversation we had at Pueblo you made me out to be the bad guy and made me feel bad for doing the right thing and protesting an illegal bike. You have twisted everything around to make me look like an asshole and discredit my name. At some point in this entire ordeal I have offended you and you have made this very personal. You have had a comeback to anything that has been said on this forum. You have bashed me about having illegal cameras on my bike which I took off, and you have said many other things about me and my bike to make it sound as if I am a cheater. I have worked hard to be legal this season. Whenever I had a question I called Ray and asked him if it was legal or not. For crying out loud I even safty wired every single exhaust spring on my bike because it is in the rulebook to do. I could only guess how many bikes have this done, because it is a royal pain in the ass. All I am asking is that you stop making this personal with me. I would ask for an appology for treating me like shit but I hear you are never wrong and don't appologize so I will settle with you just leaving the personal shit aside.


As for anybody in the club who has agreed with what I am fighting for, thank you for your support.

As for those who are mad at me for calling them out, this was not meant to be personal, I just want fair racing. If you want to take it personal that is fine, but I will advise that you stay out of my pits and leave my property alone. Whoever messed with the pitbike Sat night at Pueblo I would appreciate it if you didn't do that again. You may have thought it was funny, but I take it as a threat. If you have a problem with me talk to me face to face and we can discuss it. Do not mess with my property because you haven't grown up yet.

I would very much appreciate it if nobody mentions my name on the forums as a joke. I don't take it as being funny. When my name is mentioned I feel compelled to defend myself. I will gladly stay off the forum and not respond to this post any further. I have spoken my peace and hope that you can respect me for at least having the balls to speak up on behalf of all the MRA racers who are sick of the BS.

On a sidenote, just so you all know, when I made the protest at Pueblo I had Glenn on the radio to discuss what info he wanted me to put on my makeshift form. He relayed what he wanted on the form and I filled it out and signed it. Then later down the road I was told it was filled out improperly. Take that as you want. (Another reason to have protest forms available to racers)

[gixxermike]

Dingle has a very valid point

Racer "A" enters a race on slicks and gets DQ'd b/c the rules say no slicks

Racer "B" enters with illegal parts and gets a $50 fine and a slap on the wrist with a "you should know better" when the rules say no illegal parts


Hmmmmm

[The GECCO]

On a sidenote, just so you all know, when I made the protest at Pueblo I had Glenn on the radio to discuss what info he wanted me to put on my makeshift form. He relayed what he wanted on the form and I filled it out and signed it. Then later down the road I was told it was filled out improperly. Take that as you want. (Another reason to have protest forms available to racers)

This is not correct. Jen called me on the radio and basically said "Someone wants to protest, what do I do?" I did not "relay what I wanted", I simply told her that the protest must be written. Granted, I didn't say "make sure it conforms to the rulebook", but that's only because I had forgotten that such a thing was even IN the rulebook. Jim Brewer, who probably knows the rules better than anyone since he is in charge of preparing the rule book each year, is the person who brought it up.

FWIW, Chris, I only recall one other protest that you made against Danny. Or more correctly, I only recall one other protest against Danny and I think it was you that filed it, but I could be remembering wrong. This was the protest last year regarding Danny running RoR and AM races in the same day. This protest was not held up because during the discussion it was discovered that Danny had asked Tim Young (track marshal) if he was allowed to ride both and Tim erroneously told him yes. Because this type of protest fell to the track marshal to decide, he decided in Danny's favor because it didn't seem right punishing Danny for Tim's error. Right or wrong, that's why that decision went the way it did. I thought/assumed this was all explained to you (if it was you), but maybe not, but either way, it had nothing to do with you making your own protest form on computer paper. I don't recall any other protests being rejected because of the way they were filed, am I completely missing something?

[James W]

This is what the club needs straight cut, no bull$hi. I agree weed!

[Wild Cheetah 612]

I wasn't part of this decision, but did see the protest and signed it off as being timely.
I think there are some really good points being made. Personally, I don't like kit ECUs and the like in Supersport, but it was approved by the Rules Committee and the Board okayed it because that's what the members wanted.
Breaking the rules with windscreens, catch cans, ram air tubes, and dust covers on wheels is minor in my opinion and shouldn't result in a DQ and loss of points and money because in most cases the intent of performance advantage and resulting performance advantage is minimal.
However, rules are rules and these SS violations are getting out of control.
The Board, including Ray-Ray, wants to be fair and not overly Nazi about minor violations, but, damn! we're not the AMA yet there's money and points on the line!

So what do we as a club want to do?

Please help us out and offer some viable solutions. It's really hard making these decisions sometimes. I had to vote against my teammate and friend at Hastings for riding RoRO as a first year expert because that's what the rules say and I try my damnedest to be fair to the individual riders and to the club as a whole.

C-Weed had a legitimate protest but was called on a technicality. It was a minor violation. Put yourself in his shoes and Danny's shoes. Kinda sucks on both sides. What do you guys out there think is the solution?

[Ashli]

Is it just me or is there this sense of complete oblivian? What should we do? What is a sloution? Follow the damn rulebook for once!!!!!! This isn't "let's figure out what to do for next season" we have three races left! I'm sick of this pussy footin' around. Use the rulebook for what its there for. Crikey! Next year, yes, perhaps let's discuss some changes (hopefully on the board as well, we need people who aren't afraid to hurt feelings and want to keep it fair) in the rulebook. We need to get our members more involved in this process, and if this dabacle doesn't who the hell knows what will.

[cu260r6]

The rulebook doesn't really address the issue of discretion in deciding the penalties for infractions which is the issue Dion and Weed raised. I see a few options for curing this.

First, you could do as some suggest and have a strict DQ/points loss penalty for any infraction. In the criminal justice arena stiffer penalties for crimes do not lead to a greater deterrence value, but a greater chance of getting caught does, so this is probably not the best option. Having more teardowns each year would decrease cheating. The year I started racing in 2005 there were 3-4 teardowns, each aimed at different modifications.

Second, the rulebook could have sentencing guidelines or ranges. There could be a distinction made between non performance enhancing modifications/performance enhancing and between performance enhancing modifications that would have resulted in a significantly different outcome/not significant. Penalty ranges could be specified as warning to fine, fine to individual race points loss, individual event DQ to suspension.

Third, you could go further and specify specific penalties for specific infractions, but this is more time consuming to write, debate, and pass.

[Lel399]

The problem is, who determines what a 'performance gain' is? Ask some racers, slicks are not better than DOT's, ask some old school racers about slipper clutches, and I bet they would say it doesnt make them a bit faster. There is no way to define 'performance gain' in the real world without going by personal feelings or assumptions.

I also believe we should stick to what the rulebook states; and I really dont believe this is 'club racing'. I go out there to have fun, but there are definately guys out there to make money... and they make quite a bit of it doing this.

Club racing is a club that you gon on the weekend, get a pat on the back for doing a good job and maybe a little trophy. This is PRO-AM racing, professional racers and amateur racers alike racing together, and people make a living off of this 'club'. I think it is forgotten that peoples lives (vendors, some racers and communities raced in) are based upon the actions within the club, this is far more than 'club racing'.

I guess if there is a fix that can be taken, create an ongoing rules committee; led by the VP of Rules and Tech and one other board member that the VPR&T can choose from when there is an issue. For instance there is an on track protest... VPR&T chooses the Track Marshall to co chair that decision, other times maybe a Rider Rep (cough Brewer) that knows the rules well. The additional 3 people will be peers... must be racing members, that are not involved in the situation or class in question. The beginning of the year, 10 people can volunteer to be on the rules committee or appointed by the VPR&T to help decide on situations like this.... the logistics are a lot easier than it sounds. Decisions do not need to be immediate, given by wednesday after the race a decision will be made. With email, phones etc a concensus could be reached quite easily within those 5 people by that time.

Every other club (non motorcycle related) I have ever been with have a Rules Committee that helps decide on tough subjects, and can make a decision/change mid year. I have never seen any club up until the MRA that says once the rules are written, they are set in stone for a year. Things change mid year that can have an effect on racing. The ability to make a group decision, with the peer input is what makes clubs fair and just.

Just my 2 pennies.

[cu260r6]

The problem is, who determines what a 'performance gain' is? Ask some racers, slicks are not better than DOT's, ask some old school racers about slipper clutches, and I bet they would say it doesnt make them a bit faster. There is no way to define 'performance gain' in the real world without going by personal feelings or assumptions.

Even a marginal performance gain is a gain. Running slicks might not be classified as having a significant impact on the outcome, but by being explicitly illegal in supersport they are by definition considered a performance gain. For chassis modifications it is harder to judge, but for engine modifications it would be easy to set a 3 tiered system. If it possibly could add more than 1hp it's a performance gain, more than 5hp it's a significant factor, and if it could not possibly add more than 1hp it's not a performance gain.

Clearly the board found that there was discretion written into the rulebook at the Hastings teardown, so this would just be codifying what is currently being done. By defining penalty limits and classifications it would remove enough discretion to blunt the personal bias claim and leave enough to refine the penalty to suit individual circumstances.

[dragos13]

I completely agree with Chris Weed and everyone else who wants the rules to be followed.

For the board and the president, can I ask why the riders in Hastings were fined for $50? Was it due to the rider being on a "illegal bike" or was it something else? Also, if that is the reason isn't the penalty clearly defined in the rulebook for riding an illegal bike?

Just trying to clear things up as I plan on running SS classes as my main classes next year, and I would like a clear defined rule for running illegal mods. I currently run in the back of the SS pack and wont even run an illegal windscreen on my bike. I read the rulebook the last two years, attended the rule change meeting, and try to follow the rules as I best understand. Thanks in advance!

[JimWilson29]

I have protested him last season and this season for breaking rules and both of my protests have been thrown out due to my mistakes of making my own protest form on computer paper improperly(sidenote: I think protest forms should be provided by the MRA so that we can properly call out rule breakers).....

So why don't we have "official" protest forms created and made available in the race day office right next to the race schedules? Have a template with everything that is required listed on it. Then whoever is filing the protest has no argument if it was filled out incorrectly.

[clowe]

So I have sat around and had some great reading over the past few days about all of this but I have to say something.

First of all, in 2004 I made a protest of a certain "top rider" in the MRA. This rider was going out in Open SS on 16.5s and Slicks. His argument was that he didn't get to practice on Saturday and he was using the race for ROR practice. He had not intention of finishing the race yet he started from the back of grid and diced it up with the leaders for six laps. I protested his a$#. I would have had no problem if he would have taken the grid, let everyone go and not "raced" the actual Open SS racers. On cheating equipment, with no intention of finishing the race he could have effected the outcome. This is very wrong in my book. In the end, after the protest was filed, the board and many other members of the club came to me and asked me to take back my protest. At the end of the day I did because I was tired of the fight. I wish that I would not have but there was a part of me that was here for fun and dealing with that wasn't fun. At the time the rider would have beat on the track no matter what so I kind of left it at that. Also, it seemed like no one on the board really wanted to deal with it (BTW, different board than we have now).

Fast forward to the following year. My Suzuki GSXR 750 made 138 HP. There was a certain Yamaha R6 that was running in Heavyweight SS. This R6 would have no problem rolling past me after the 1/4 mile mark at Pueblo. Was the rider good, yes. Was his bike legal, I don't know because I never protested him. I heard later that that bike had cams, a kit ECU and a different charging system among other things. Was that a performance advantage, for sure. Do I know all of this for sure, nope. Like I said, I never protested this rider because A) I wanted to beat them while they were riding a cheater bike (which I did) B) I wanted that bike torn down to the crank and I didn't think anyone would ever actually allow it to get to that point C) As mentioned in this thread I didn't want someone tearing my bike down and I'll explain why next.

So, here is the real issue with all of this that I have seen. My bikes have been looked at for years. I have often had people think I was cheating (Ben, this is for you 00--00 ) for years, but my bikes always go through with flying colors. BUT, here is the issue. I build my bike in my garage and as I whole, I know very little. Ask anyone who have has ever come to my pits to help me with something. I am not mechanically inclined and for the most part have not idea what I am doing. All of my motors are bone stock and the rest is stuff that I bolt on. I am telling everyone all of this for a reason. The rule book to me is very unclear and I would hate to loose all my points, results and $$$ won because I didn't understand some in the rule book. My friend pointed out something to me after the tear down in Hastings that could have been deemed illegal and I was floored. I was floored because it was so simple and I figured it out on my own so I figured it had to be legal. AND, the way I read the rule book, it was fine. AND, my bike went through the teardown and no one, not Ray, Ben or Glenn said a thing. In truth to this day, I don't know if I was OK or not. It is that issue that scares me about this whole thing and something that I feel needs to be taken into account. Because I am not a pro racer or mechanic, nor would I be able to afford racing if I had to employ one, I am at risk of making a mistake that costs me my season. That does not seem right when the rule book is not clear. Now, if I have cams, crank work and pistons, OK, I know I'm doing something wrong. But to lose your whole season because of a catch can, that does not seem right. I do think there has to be some intent somewhere in the rules because a catch can is different than a stroker motor.

Also, I have crashed and bent a frame, much like many of you have. By the rules, you can not weld that frame nor can you alter that frame at all. That includes getting it straightened after you have crashed your brains out. Do we really want SS riders to have to buy a new frame anytime they break off a rear-set tab or a swingarm spool? That does not seem right to me. The rules committee has told me many times that the point of SS is to be more cost effective. That is the reasoning for not allowing rain tires in SS, because then you increase the cost. What is we had to buy a new frame every time you fall down. And, in truth, if you have an 07 you can only by an 07 frame even though an 06 would work because there is not backdating of parts. This all seems that it is going to start making SS racing very expensive. I can think of something on every SS racers bike that would make it fall into this category.

So, is this cheating and breaking the rules? Is having your rearset welding back on the same as running 16.5s and slicks in SS? Is having aftermaket ram-air tubes the same as having a kit ECU (was not legal at the time), cams, a kit charging system and kit pistons?

Those all do not seem the same to me so maybe we need to better define this before our next race is a protest fest!

[dragos13]

So, is this cheating and breaking the rules? Is having your rearset welding back on the same as running 16.5s and slicks in SS? Is having aftermaket ram-air tubes the same as having a kit ECU (was not legal at the time), cams, a kit charging system and kit pistons?

Those all do not seem the same to me so maybe we need to better define this before our next race is a protest fest!

Crash, I agree that by opinion those shouldn't all have the same penalties. Thats why we need to change the rulebook for next year. Give the board a list of possible penalties in which all or just one can be applied.

However, as most of the racers see the current rule book, there is only one penalty for running an illegally modded bike in any class. That is not something that was written to be judged and modified come time. Maybe next year we should write the rules that the board can punish based on favor and opinion. I'm sure this will work great with the racers (atleast a few) :roll:

[benfoxmra95]

This is ridiculous.

Protest Forms...? WTF...

is that what we want this club to turn into? a bunch a whining Effen crybabys with sand in their chauch that protest everything in sight.

There were just over 70 entrys out at hastings, Lets tear them all down to the last bolt and see who goes home with a trophy. Let's piss everyone off, let's send everyone home. Then maybe we can get down to only 3 riders per class and everyone gets a trophy.

There were 8 people entered in Oss at hastings. Lets kick 3 of them out, and see what happens to your precious contingency money from suzuki and yamaha and honda etc...

If someone in front of me is running a double bubble windscreen. I don't care. He's in front of me for more reasons than that.

If someone is in front of me and has a big bore motor, then good for him and He'll have to live with that fact in his mind that he knows he's a cheater and wasn't skilled enough as a rider.


Is this truly how you people want to beat each other? with a rule book? I wouldn't accept one Trophy that was given to me if I had to use the rule book to get it.


The MRA board is doing some of the best work they can with what they have to work with, calling them out and dragging them down doesn't help anything at all. If you for one minute think they don't have the entire memberships best interest in their minds, then you need to go race elsewhere.

I started racing in this club 11 years ago, I have seen some stupid shit and this finger pointing and "oh woe is me" crap, and all the other garbage dribbling here is tipping my B.S. meter.

This club has been around for pretty long time and operating on basically the same set of rules for more years than I know, They seemed to have worked pretty well up until now.

[benfoxmra95]

So, is this cheating and breaking the rules? Is having your rearset welding back on the same as running 16.5s and slicks in SS? Is having aftermaket ram-air tubes the same as having a kit ECU (was not legal at the time), cams, a kit charging system and kit pistons?

Those all do not seem the same to me so maybe we need to better define this before our next race is a protest fest!

Maybe next year we should write the rules that the board can punish based on favor and opinion. I'm sure this will work great with the racers (atleast a few) :roll:

What reasons do you have to bash the board here?

How have they wronged you, that you feel you need to take a jab at them with that statement?

Let me open this question up to everyone....Has anyone in this club been wronged somehow by the board? Speak up...

[dragos13]

So, is this cheating and breaking the rules? Is having your rearset welding back on the same as running 16.5s and slicks in SS? Is having aftermaket ram-air tubes the same as having a kit ECU (was not legal at the time), cams, a kit charging system and kit pistons?

Those all do not seem the same to me so maybe we need to better define this before our next race is a protest fest!

Maybe next year we should write the rules that the board can punish based on favor and opinion. I'm sure this will work great with the racers (atleast a few) :roll:

What reasons do you have to bash the board here?

How have they wronged you, that you feel you need to take a jab at them with that statement?

Let me open this question up to everyone....Has anyone in this club been wronged somehow by the board? Speak up...

The board didnt wrong me, they could DQ the top 5 riders in SS and I'm still out of the money either way. I'm not fighting for myself, I'm just looking for clarification. I read the rulebook one way, and it says you get DQ'd when you run a bike deamed illegal for a class. I want to know how and where the $50 is justified, other then based on opinion. Not trying to make anyone hate me on this topic, but are the rules not clearly defined for punishment on illegal bikes? Regardless if its a SBK built motor or an incorrectly routed vent tube?

I just see way too much "opinion" being thrown into a ruling that is written in the rulebook. Thats why for next year maybe it can say:

Punishment for illegally modded bikes can include one or all of the following:

1. $50
2. DQ'd points
3. Etc.

[JimWilson29]

This is ridiculous.

Protest Forms...? WTF...

is that what we want this club to turn into? a bunch a whining Effen crybabys with sand in their chauch that protest everything in sight.

There were just over 70 entrys out at hastings, Lets tear them all down to the last bolt and see who goes home with a trophy. Let's piss everyone off, let's send everyone home. Then maybe we can get down to only 3 riders per class and everyone gets a trophy.

There were 8 people entered in Oss at hastings. Lets kick 3 of them out, and see what happens to your precious contingency money from suzuki and yamaha and honda etc...

If someone in front of me is running a double bubble windscreen. I don't care. He's in front of me for more reasons than that.

If someone is in front of me and has a big bore motor, then good for him and He'll have to live with that fact in his mind that he knows he's a cheater and wasn't skilled enough as a rider.


Is this truly how you people want to beat each other? with a rule book? I wouldn't accept one Trophy that was given to me if I had to use the rule book to get it.


The MRA board is doing some of the best work they can with what they have to work with, calling them out and dragging them down doesn't help anything at all. If you for one minute think they don't have the entire memberships best interest in their minds, then you need to go race elsewhere.

I started racing in this club 11 years ago, I have seen some stupid shit and this finger pointing and "oh woe is me" crap, and all the other garbage dribbling here is tipping my B.S. meter.

This club has been around for pretty long time and operating on basically the same set of rules for more years than I know, They seemed to have worked pretty well up until now.

Not my intention when I made the suggestion of an official protest form. Just throwing out an idea for when there is a legitimate protest situation to make the process more efficient so that they are not tossed out because of the technicality that it was not filled out correctly.